How come there was no non evil stun immune item in what I understand was probably the final update?

Darteous

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i play ironman mage when I play. Most of the time I die it's because of stun/paralysis. Because I'm not willing to be evil anything near the end game is extremely dangerous for my character so I get to a higher level than necessary in the hopes of living through whatever stun I get. My lvl 19 summon golem and tank gris was at 21 couldn't even help. Today I got stunned as I walked in the door at the undercity by an oracle, gris and my golem were stuck behind me because the door only fit one person, the warlord then slaughtered me. I had ~250 life remaining and was a bit tanky myself. So annoying, I understanding giving people the choice of being evil for nice items like bishops ring, but it's quite irksome to require people be evil for an item that is basically mandatory.
 

VDX_360

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Ouch!

A slow death due to stun lock is frustrating.

Let's explore.

There's a comingling of three game issues in this post. Stun Mechanics, Stun Immunity and Companion AI,

First, the game's stun mechanic doesn't appear to work as intended. There appears to be an issue where you have to have at least 50 Spirit Resistance to get any benefit. And even if you do get some stun resistance, the odds are that you will still get hit with the full effect often enough to make stun lock possible.

Second, there are limited pieces of equipment that offer Stun Immunity, and the skill Battle Rage is for Warriors Only. The Cleric skill Battle Prayer and all class skill Spiritual Ward offers some stun resistance, but it's limited due the game mechanic issue above.

Third, Companions and Summons make terrible tacticians. There's a list somewhere of all the odd things Companions have done due to AI oddities. Note, they tend to have the same movement AI as monsters, so enemies can do the silly things, too.


Some things you can do:

Using spirit potions / equipment / skills will --in theory-- offer some stun protection but there's a debate if the game mechanic is working. And even if it is working, it requires an extensive investment in those areas.

Have elemental resistance. Insane Wizard (Blue) hit with pure ice damage. So really high ice resistance buys you more time against their attacks, including up to infinite time if you have near maxed ice resistence.

Ranged Weapons: Giving Griss a bow can -sometimes- allow her to attack when you are blocking the way. Due to AI issues, not a prefect system.


AND THE MOST IMPORTANT THING TO DO:

Just don't play on Ironman.

Really.

It's that simple.

One of the many reasons I dislike the Die-Hard-Iron-Man mentality is that it's unrealistic, creates undue frustrations, and most IronMan players are cheating the perma-death so it's not like they actually playing ironman. They just want bragging rights.

Hard is the exact same game as IronMan, but with the nifty benefit that if there's a game issue, extreme bad luck, of real-world-inference, you still have the game.

That way if you die from an enemy, you're not screaming at the word about it being unfair, you can enjoy the monster's victory and learn from it.
 

VDX_360

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Also,

There's enough in-game stuff to have a debate if The Lady of Night is truly evil, of if she's just a but passionate about not being a slave anymore. So one could argue that siding against her in favor of the City Watch is the more lawful option, it's tough to conclude with certainty that it's the "evil" thing to do.

I think most players will take the viewpoint it's a bit evil to giver her heart back to her, but it's not fully supported. I think that's delibrate as the game hints at a future fight between you and an evil member of The Three.

As for the Bishops Ring, neither option is actually evil.

If you give the Crown to the Bishop, he willingly dies to save you, and the crown is presumably put somewhere safe. That's a good outcome.

If you give the Crown to the rightful owner, the Bishop lives, the crown is removed from the world, and the Tol error starts to be set-right. That's a good outcome, with far better effects than the first.

So neither is "evil", just one option requires having more knowledge of the world to know it's lasting effects.

So, how this ties back to the Original Post, is that the OP makes certain in-game decisions that have consequences based on a personal viewpoint of role-playing.
 

Neponde

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Ironman is accepting the risk of things like that happening. I get the frustration of no clear "lightside" stun immunity too. I play on ironman because its the only thing that is a challenge anymore. Its kinda boring on hard.

But thats a personal choice. Blowing up a level 20 sucks, but the journey there is fun
. 😀
 

AnneLong

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I think they delete or hide to ensure the balance of the game, some other games unblocked do the same, I believe they do it on their own accord and after a while we will have to adapt
 
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Kakost

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A world of advice playing Mage: NEVER lead the charge if you can avoid it. If you're in a dungeon, always put that big shield called Grissenda in front of you, and just simply push her foward. It's easy to do it on walls.
 

Darteous

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If she were just a native god banished to another realm cuz some manifest destiny type nonsense then that'd be debatable if she were actually evil, but based on the information about the witches of Orogg she's clearly evil without even knowing about the rumor that starts going around after the quest is finished "Something is rotten in Icemist. People are disappearing every night.". Which makes that choice definitively evil.

Choosing to give a great man a crown that you know will kill him is wrong and when you know there's an alternative you're capable of completing that won't kill him it becomes evil.

Good and evil are all about what you know. If a person doesn't know how to complete the Tol quest then sure they may just be negligent in harming the older priest by giving him the crown, but if you're into the game then you're going to have gotten all of the information and be able to do it.

I do back my saves up to the cloud just in case there's a glitch and the death isn't my fault. Learned that lesson after kicking the door by amarisa with my shock barrier on and ended up dying. But I won't use those saves for deaths that are my fault, only glitches. The lack of stun resistance for mages that doesn't require an evil choice is intentional, not a glitch.

I'd hoped having to overpowered companions would make it manageable, and for the most part it was, I killed many liches with no problem, but it's not fullproof because of reasons mentioned.

Permadeath is very realistic, when you die you're dead.
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A world of advice playing Mage: NEVER lead the charge if you can avoid it. If you're in a dungeon, always put that big shield called Grissenda in front of you, and just simply push her foward. It's easy to do it on walls.
It's quite tedious to line her up and push her, which I have done at times to be on the safe side early on in the game up to about level 12. But to always have to do it is boring and annoying use of time that it starts to feel like why bother playing. I was 4 levels higher than the opponent and had some of the best gear in the game but I have to line up the companion to a door to push them through first everytime just in case?
 
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VDX_360

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Let's explore.

The Witches of Orogg made some type of deal with something powerful in order overthrow slave masters and invaders. Hard to argue that's objectively evil. Hard to draw a line between when a slave is justified in freeing itself, and when it becomes evil? Again, there's most certainly an evil vibe to the witches plot, but nothing in-game makes it an air-tight case.

The Crown of Tol is still a debate. Let's presume your character found and deciphered the hidden text, and knows there's a way to return a powerful artifact of a God of Death. Plenty of Good people will still decide the most good action is to still give the Crown to the Bishop. They will likely say that that's the will of The Three via the orders of the Bishop, or argue that keeping the Crown away from Tol is worth more than a single life. It takes out-game-knowledge (or more than one play through) to realize Tol will leave the world behind. Nothing in-game hints at that idea.
 

VDX_360

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I do back my saves up to the cloud just in case there's a glitch and the death isn't my fault.

By the Kick of the Invisible Swap Donkey!

Than you are NOT really playing IronMan.

You could simply play on Hard, and than delete your game on arbitrary rules as a player enforced penalty.

But to complain about the game being too hard on IronMan while YOU ARE CHEATING AT IRONMAN is so blatantly uncouth one might mistake you for a lifelong member of the Wizard's Guild.

Just play on Hard, because clearly that's what you want to do.
 

Atomos

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@Darteous there is another way for mages to resist stun (and paralysis), you have to boost your spirit resistance. Try this setup:

Tiara of the Mentalist/Broken Crown of Tol (that's a progamer option)
Tunic of the Lighting Priest/Plexifiber Robe/Undermother's Hide
Automated Gloves
Holy Symbol of the Three/Violet Medalion
Totem of Protection
Ring of the Mentalist/Ring of Unlife x2
Cloak of the Dark Fate/Mantle of Iron Will
Sandals of the Saint
Spirit Ward advanced skill
Potion of Clarity
I believe 210 points give 100% resistance, but even 150 points are useable (that's ~80% resistance), and should prevent continuous stun
 

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