Thoughts on the nature of Magic and the Ascended Immortals [SPOILERS]

Lolerescut

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BattleLord":37hhr6eo said:
Lolerescut":37hhr6eo said:
Tol was betrayed by his servents as far as i remember reading scriptures and stuff

Not exactly true. Tol was indeed betrayed by his servants, but that was after the whole thing with the Three. His servants betrayed him by not waking him up because they were scared he wouldn't be happy by seeing how they had acted while he was gone.
Could be i dont recall the betrayal story too well
 

Dark Mage Ascended

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I see. It appears magic is not inherent to objects, but merely a byproduct of energies. That explains it.
As for Tol, he was betrayed both by his servants and by the Three. The records in the Forgotten Temple clearly state there were other gods, which betrayed Tol, and the Three are the most likely to be those. Only after being betrayed and slumbering in Irazur for what I can guess were millenia, his own Priests betrayed his teaching and orders. They preyed upon the living instead of co existing with them peacefully.
 

Lolerescut

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Dark Mage Ascended":2sb65a4m said:
I see. It appears magic is not inherent to objects, but merely a byproduct of energies. That explains it.
As for Tol, he was betrayed both by his servants and by the Three. The records in the Forgotten Temple clearly state there were other gods, which betrayed Tol, and the Three are the most likely to be those. Only after being betrayed and slumbering in Irazur for what I can guess were millenia, his own Priests betrayed his teaching and orders. They preyed upon the living instead of co existing with them peacefully.
Wasnt tol one of the three?
 

Grim Rapper

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Just throwing my two cents on this (also HUGE nerd autism ahead)

About the contradictory between Muud's Technology and Varannari's magic is (in my opinion) based on where it comes from, when you look at the Mage description that's stated "Mages harness great destructive powers with several offensive spells, and in a more limited way, some defensive abilities" which the word harness is defined as to "control and make use of (natural resources), especially to produce energy". which can be assumed that the nature of Magic itself can be categorized as a natural raw energy that can be harnessed by a selective individual.

That being said, I don't really think that the Muud'ari understands magic (the byproduct of the Varannari Continent) at all, not only because of Oracle's reaction towards magical equipment but also that the Ark of Lothasan doesn't have the capability towards magical force in the first place (hence the cause of devastating crash at Ashen Wastes). The main reason of the Muud's equipment is able to increase the Mage's power (in terms of mana) is (along with David's statement) is that the equipment itself is a "container" of raw energy that Mages can harness its raw energy to their will.
 

Dark Mage Ascended

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Lolerescut":1s6w3pct said:
Dark Mage Ascended":1s6w3pct said:
I see. It appears magic is not inherent to objects, but merely a byproduct of energies. That explains it.
As for Tol, he was betrayed both by his servants and by the Three. The records in the Forgotten Temple clearly state there were other gods, which betrayed Tol, and the Three are the most likely to be those. Only after being betrayed and slumbering in Irazur for what I can guess were millenia, his own Priests betrayed his teaching and orders. They preyed upon the living instead of co existing with them peacefully.
Wasnt tol one of the three?

It appears so. Originally, it was the Four, but with Tol out of the picture, they became the Three.
 

Lolerescut

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Grim Rapper":1e4pap16 said:
Just throwing my two cents on this (also HUGE nerd autism ahead)

About the contradictory between Muud's Technology and Varannari's magic is (in my opinion) based on where it comes from, when you look at the Mage description that's stated "Mages harness great destructive powers with several offensive spells, and in a more limited way, some defensive abilities" which the word harness is defined as to "control and make use of (natural resources), especially to produce energy". which can be assumed that the nature of Magic itself can be categorized as a natural raw energy that can be harnessed by a selective individual.

That being said, I don't really think that the Muud'ari understands magic (the byproduct of the Varannari Continent) at all, not only because of Oracle's reaction towards magical equipment but also that the Ark of Lothasan doesn't have the capability towards magical force in the first place (hence the cause of devastating crash at Ashen Wastes). The main reason of the Muud's equipment is able to increase the Mage's power (in terms of mana) is (along with David's statement) is that the equipment itself is a "container" of raw energy that Mages can harness its raw energy to their will.
Well if you conpleted the game with lady laenna joining you against the horrors you will find she is a mage
 

Dark Mage Ascended

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Lolerescut":1kkj8q4z said:
Grim Rapper":1kkj8q4z said:
Well if you conpleted the game with lady laenna joining you against the horrors you will find she is a mage

When we say "The Muud'Ari don't understand magic", that doesn't mean all Muud'Ari are uncapable of understanding magic. It just means the Muud'Ari civilization doesn't understand it, because they dont even know it exists. Laenna understands magic because she's from the EK planet. That's where she was born, raised and educated, just like all of the Forsaken, so of course they know what it is and how it works. A Muud'Ari born in any other planet of their empire is not aware of Magic's existance.
 

Lolerescut

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Dark Mage Ascended":1nu1mwas said:
Lolerescut":1nu1mwas said:
Grim Rapper":1nu1mwas said:
Well if you conpleted the game with lady laenna joining you against the horrors you will find she is a mage

When we say "The Muud'Ari don't understand magic", that doesn't mean all Muud'Ari are uncapable of understanding magic. It just means the Muud'Ari civilization doesn't understand it, because they dont even know it exists. Laenna understands magic because she's from the EK planet. That's where she was born, raised and educated, just like all of the Forsaken, so of course they know what it is and how it works. A Muud'Ari born in any other planet of their empire is not aware of Magic's existance.
Yes but the forsaken are the only mudaari that are left based on the info on the arcg when tge portal opens a parasite enters and the portal is most likely to have been used on their planet since no rescue was sent to take them
 

Dark Mage Ascended

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Lolerescut":xlc3205j said:
Dark Mage Ascended":xlc3205j said:
Lolerescut":xlc3205j said:
Well if you conpleted the game with lady laenna joining you against the horrors you will find she is a mage
...

We don't know that. We are talking about a vast interstellar empire touching on Three know how many worlds. Even if Noutamet was decimated, tens or even hundreds of colonies exist. The most likely possibility in my opinion is that the Muud'ari have several colonization projects active simultaneously, and no one actually knows the Ark of Lothasan was destroyed. We're talking about colpnizing a planet here: it would take a few centuries of work to convert the planet into a suitable colony and we dont even know how fast they can send help. They waited 20 thousand yearsfter the Seed ship touched the planet to get started on colonizing.
 

Grim Rapper

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Lolerescut":3newgiqe said:
Well if you completed the game with lady laenna joining you against the horrors you will find she is a mage
The Forsaken is as blind as you do in terms of knowing the Muud'ari's technology, they didn't know the consequence of this said "immortality" nor the existence of the Horror in the first place. Their knowledge is just as far as "We are better than these other humans around us" based on your encounter with The Magister and their reactions.

Also, I didn't say that The Forsaken didn't understand magic, because they're trapped in Varannari's Land after the crash in the first place. There is a possibility of them to be settled down and have a generation that gifted with the power of magic, but it still didn't prove that the initial Muud'ari civilizations understand it in the first place.

About the said Ascended, I remember some discussion within a forum that has a in-depth information about it somewhere
 

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